MEMPHIS – In what brahminical sources described as strict attachment to the Krishna conscious philosophy, local brahmacarini, Abhava devi dasi, threw herself against the wall on five separate occasions yesterday to clear the path as saffron-clad male-bodied devotees walked past her in several different hallways.
“It is fact,” said two-year adherent, bhakta Randal, “she is nicely following Vedic culture by getting the hell out of my way, otherwise, she is simply prostitute.” Adding, “Could you let her know that I think it’s really nice, that she gets the hell out of my way? Could you tell her that for me?”
Abhava devi dasi sustained slight abrasions and a bruise on her knee as she got the hell out of the way for His Holiness Matsarya das Goswami as they passed each other in the downstairs hallway near the lobby.
“She is so chaste,” reports Sri Danda das brahmacari, “just see how completely her head is covered. And how her eyes never quite make contact with yours.”
Another brahmacari questioned, “I wonder what color they are.”
One such event was witnessed by a family visiting the temple for the first time. “What was that about?” Asked Ron Browning, the father of the family of four, after seeing Abhava devi dasi trip over her own feet to get the hell out of the way near the washroom as several Hare Krishna monks wandered by. “That just doesn’t seem right.”
When questioned about his temple’s unspoken policy about brahmacarinis, Kamarupam Swami, temple commander and bhakta leader, disagreed that it was sexist.
“The idea that women are mistreated in the temple is completely bogus.” He continued, “outside the temple, they are practically trained to casually walk past so many men. Is that not abuse?”
Temple visitors are not the only ones talking about Abhava devi dasi’s behavior. Talk in the men’s ashrama has turned to discussing her actions as well.
“I really appreciate her dedication to Srila Prabhupada,” says Pradhana das, during the brahmacari ashrama’s Tuesday night Bhagavad-gita study group, “she gets the hell out of my way better than any mataji I’ve ever seen.”
“It’s true,” added life-long brahmacari, Devakanya das, “Have you ever noticed that even though Abhava’s long, brown hair sways back and forth, it never comes undone as she glides across the floor to the wall?”
“And how, when she casts herself to the wall as we move past, her sari nearly exposes her slender waist giving way to the soft curve of her hips,” said Menaka das, closing his eyes. “Even as she gets the hell out of my way, she remains such a nice, chaste mataji.”
Abhava devi dasi’s conduct has not gone unnoticed. “Most women do not understand how to act in front of men,” Kamarupam Swami said after a thoughtful pause. “Most women will casually stroll by, hardly noticing me at all. But when Abhava devi dasi gets the hell out of my way, I can fell her sincere concern for my spiritual life.”
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76 responses so far ↓
1 jaganat // May 30, 2008 at 4:08 pm
Such a nice mataji is the delight of amy serious brahmacari, indeed.
2 Dwija // May 30, 2008 at 9:23 pm
I do hope mataji will be getting the hell out of the way whenever a brahmacari dances enthusiastically, as close to her as possible, in kirtan. There’s nothing worse than some Mayadevi prostitute agitating the mind of an innocent, pure hearted Prabhu.
3 Devak // May 31, 2008 at 2:06 pm
Dearest Devotees:
Actually myself and several other goswamis have solved the problem of those mayadevi matijis by wearing those new glasses that make the matajis invisible to our purified eyes. We wear them all the time.
Of course they do have their downside. Right now I am a bit bruised and bandaged because I ran smack dab into several lovely matijis because I just could not see them whilst I wear these newfangled glasses.
Maybe the matijis could ring a little brass bell when they see some holy, innocent and pure hearted seriously fallen guru or brahmacari walking in their direction.
It’s always something, isn’t it?
Oh for the wonderful days when the brahmacaris could even have the matijis up to their rooms for Gita study. Pure nector.
Devak….formerly known as Your Divine Grace
PS: I may have to leave Rishikesh as there are too many sadhus here. The city council only allows four million sadhus here at any one time.
4 Arjuna dasa // Jun 1, 2008 at 2:24 am
what a bunch of prajalpic nonsense and gramya katha…why are you all engaging in vaisnava aparadha by mocking Srila Prabhupada’s and the guru parampara’s strict intructions, especially concerning strict temple life, regarding proper Vaisnava etiquette when it comes to temple standards and brahmacari/sanyassi and female interaction? It seems to me a thinly veiled attempt at saying that the regulative principles of krsna consciousness are just “old-fashioned”, “outdated”, “outmoded” (words that so-called envious and neophyte devotee “feminists” have used to describe austere temple life) and that you really and sadly have no real taste in following or relishing. How unfortunate. I suppose you would jokingly suggest that the respectful Vedic titles of “mataji” or “mother” before the name of a female devotee be replaced with “prabhu”, a term reserved for male devotees and on very rare occassions (according to Srila Prabhupada) female devotees. It may be the year 2008, but going outside of the guru parampara with unauthorized and unorthodoxed ideas and habits regarding the rules of male/female devotee interaction that Prabhupda taught and strictly enforced are never “en vogue”, to employ a karmi slogan in Lord Krsna’s service.
Hare krsna
Arjuna dasa
disciple of HH Bhaktiswarupa Damodara Swami
http://sankirtanadiary.blogspot.com
5 jaganat // Jun 1, 2008 at 3:52 am
The Hing is successful in bringing the fundamentalist out of their “nice” masquerade.
We do not need any menace from a narrow minded born again krishnian, to advance in our Krishna consciouness.
Those “little Prabhus” cheap cheer leaders are in fact the cause of our movement dwindling to the size of a religion. Thank you Eric.
6 Arjuna dasa // Jun 1, 2008 at 4:15 am
So, Jaganat , are you afraid to address me directly? I can see why. As an aspiring devotee myself, “a narrow minded born again krishnian” as you call me, i would loathe to refer to another Vaisnava and sadhaka as a “fundamentalist” and a “menace” which are just code words anyway used by so-called devotees and kali-chelas and demons in an attempt to disparage and discourage serious-minded, enthusiastic and dedicated devotees from executing devotional service and carrying out the orders and isntructions and teachings of Srila Prabhupada and the guru sampradaya…I would be very fearful of my future in krsna consciousness and devotional service and the association of strictly practicing Vaisnavas if I directly addressed another devotee as such…and I am curious, if a devotee is not to strictly follow the teachings of His Divine Grace and his guru maharaja–what you would call “fundamentalist” or “fanatical” or “a menace”–then what is a devotee to do? treat the regulative principles like a buffet? a little sex life here won’t hurt?…a little unsanctified karma-laden karmi food there wont hurt? a little karmi reading, tv, cinema? 4 rounds a day? 8 rounds a day? respect some devotees, but belittle others? a little mental specualtion here, a little sense gratification there…?
I think the problem lies in the sour grapes—you don’t have the taste for Krsna so no one else can but then again , to you, I am just a ““little Prabhus” cheap cheer leader” (so you are not only making aparadha toward Srila Prabhupada’s grand-disciples but also ISKCON’s seniormost Prabhupada disciples?) so what would I know?
Hare krsna
Arjuna dasa
Disciple of HH Bhaktiswarupa Damodara Swami
7 premasru // Jun 2, 2008 at 12:57 am
Hilarious! Wonderful! Thank you. This pretty much sums up my past experience of Iskcon, and is no doubt experienced in Gaudiya Maths elsewhere, that men matter and women don’t.
Oh, and especially in India. . .in a very annoyed and self-important commanding tone, “Side Mataji, side.” Lest Brahmacaridas, fresh out of a bucket bath be contaminated by a billowing sari wearer.
Fortunately, reality lies elsewhere.
Thoroughly enjoyed this post.
8 Achyuta // Jun 3, 2008 at 3:08 pm
haha..I second Premasru. Awesome one Eric!
9 Sraddha // Jun 3, 2008 at 8:05 pm
Where is Arjuna’s sense of humour?
Brilliant one Eric…
10 Appreciate Reader // Jun 3, 2008 at 8:37 pm
Arjuna doesn’t have a sense of humor. His kaupinas are way too tight.
Yes, Eric, BRILLIANT!
11 Anonymous d.d. // Jun 3, 2008 at 8:42 pm
I think ALL the women of ISKCON will be getting the hell out of Eric’s way, because he is clearly “the man”! (Is he single?)
12 JayBlissNectar // Jun 4, 2008 at 12:01 am
Arjuna dasa, I’ll address your directly. Your approach to spiritual life is indicative of major personal problems and obvious psychopathology. I doubt any god or guru would be pleased with your particular variety of “devotion”. It is precisely because your type of sanctimonious relf-righteousness is so prevalent in institutional Hare Krsna settings that articles like this are being written.
Keep it up, Eric – your writing is the most suitable remedy for those possessed of twisted faith, who inevitably take themselves far too seriously.
13 Praveen // Jun 4, 2008 at 12:21 am
Im not sure which is funnier, the article or arjuna das’ comments.
14 Arjuna dasa // Jun 4, 2008 at 1:23 am
JayBlissNectar: If my approach to spiritual life–which I clearly delineated and explained in most of my comments to these odious and ulterior-motive laden and hidden agenda-filled so-called humor pieces–is “indicative of major personal problems and obvious psychopathology”, then you my friend–whose heart seems to be hardened by countless anarthas and spiritual advancement obstructed by the commission of too many aparadhas to guru, nama and Vaisnava too count–are as saintly as the late serial killer/cannibal Jeffrey Dahmer, much before his jailhouse conversion to Christianity, mind you. In all honesty though, joking aside–see I can be “funny” too my fellow Hingites, though I doubt I will win the hate- and venom-filled hearts of any of the envious, deviant hypocrites who post here–I will let Srila Prabhupada–who, much to your chagrin, I strictly, whole-heartedly and enthusiastically follow (ie: rise early at 4AM for mangala aratrika and chant 16 rounds daily, follow the regulative principles of krsna consciousness, perform devotional service, serve and associate with like-minded devotees, you know all that stuff that you would consider indicative of “major personal problems and obvious psychopathology” )–have the first AND last word, from Sri Upadesamrta, on this matter:
If we consider the bodily defects of a Vaisnava, we should understand that we are committing an offense at the lotus feet of the Vaisnava. An offense at the lotus feet of a Vaisnava is very serious. Indeed, Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu has described this offense as hātī-mātā, the mad elephant offense. A mad elephant can create a disaster, especially when it enters into a nicely trimmed garden. One should therefore be very careful not to commit any offense against a Vaisnava. Every devotee should be ready to take instructions from a superior Vaisnava, and a superior Vaisnava must be ready to help an inferior Vaisnava in all respects. One is superior or inferior according to his spiritual development in Krsna consciousness. One is forbidden to observe the activities of a pure Vaisnava from a material point of view. For the neophyte especially, considering a pure devotee from a material point of view is very injurious. One should therefore avoid observing a pure devotee externally, but should try to see the internal features and understand how he is engaged in the transcendental loving service of the Lord. In this way one can avoid seeing the pure devotee from a material point of view, and thus one can gradually become a purified devotee himself.
Those who think that Krsna consciousness is limited to a certain section of people, a certain section of devotees or a certain tract of land are generally prone to see the external features of the devotee. Such neophytes, unable to appreciate the exalted service of the advanced devotee, try to bring the mahā-bhāgavata to their platform. We experience such difficulty in propagating this Krsna consciousness all over the world. Unfortunately we are surrounded by neophyte Godbrothers who do not appreciate the extraordinary activities of spreading Krsna consciousness all over the world. They simply try to bring us to their platform, and they try to criticize us in every respect. We very much regret their naive activities and poor fund of knowledge. An empowered person who is actually engaged in the confidential service of the Lord should not be treated as an ordinary human being, for it is stated that unless one is empowered by Krsna, one cannot spread the Krsna consciousness movement all over the world.
When one thus criticizes a pure devotee, he commits an offense (vaisnava-aparādha) that is very obstructive and dangerous for those who desire to advance in Krsna consciousness. A person cannot derive any spiritual benefit when he offends the lotus feet of a Vaisnava. Everyone should therefore be very careful not to be jealous of an empowered Vaisnava, or a śuddha-vaisnava. It is also an offense to consider an empowered Vaisnava an object of disciplinary action. It is offensive to try to give him advice or to correct him. One can distinguish between a neophyte Vaisnava and an advanced Vaisnava by their activities. The advanced Vaisnava is always situated as the spiritual master, and the neophyte is always considered his disciple. The spiritual master must not be subjected to the advice of a disciple, nor should a spiritual master be obliged to take instructions from those who are not his disciples. This is the sum and substance of Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī’s advice in the sixth verse.
JayBlissNectar, you probably thought I wouldn’t have the astuteness and presence of mind—psychopathological as you think I am;(are you even qualified to make such a diagnosis? Prabhupada forbade his followers to rely on unauthorized pseudo-intellects like psychoanaysts)–to let your “sanctimonious self-righteousness” dig at me go unchallenged. But, as I explained in previous comments, these pernicious little pejoratives–popular of late with the former disgruntled, envious so-called devotee crowd and aimed at serious-minded devotees within ISKCON–such as “conservative”, (personally I don’t mind that one since I would rather be known to strictly rather than loosely, whimsically and haphazardly apply myself to the regualtive principles of krsna consciousness) “self-righteous”, “ultra-orthodoxed”, “kool-aid drinkers” and , even the all-time karmi favorite, “brainwashed” are actually code-words, employed and used subtly and cleverly by miscreants and rascals and meant to distract, discourage, disparage strictly following Vaisnavas, who, in turn, may be critical and wary–as Srila Prabhupada instructed his followers to be–of the so-called devotees preoccupation and fascination with philosophical deviations like sahajiyaism, feminism, New Age atheism and other illusory pursuits of mental speculation and sense gratification.
15 jaganat // Jun 4, 2008 at 1:32 am
Praveen: I vote for arjun dasa as the main contributor to The Hing. He beats Eric by far, he actually “believes” his articles.
16 Devak // Jun 4, 2008 at 1:52 am
Kanhangad, Kerala, South India
June 4 – 08
Hello Arjuna Prabhu:
Listen to me. Shhhhh….for just a moment.
Does your guru know that you are reading The Hing? What’s up with you reading this? Do you have your gurus’ permission to lay your eyes on this website.
This site is a very serious discussion about various aspects of vasinava life. It’s only for the most experienced and able minded people steeped in Vedic culture.
I advise caution .
Devak…..taking surfing lessons at the beach in Kerala tomorrow. I go to Temple next week, maybe if I have time.
17 JayBlissNectar // Jun 4, 2008 at 2:02 am
Arjuna, in light of your last comment it is clear that talk therapy will not adequately address your current condition. Psychiatry will be more helpful in the first instance – a presciption for Prozac is relatively inexpensive, and you will be pleased to hear that it can also be used safely in conjunction with the other anti-psychotic medications s that you so obviously require.
18 Rati // Jun 4, 2008 at 8:57 am
Anonymous d.d.- hahahahahahah!!! That’s hilarious!
(And yes, he is.)
Praveen, I love your comment! Hari bol!
19 Appreciative Reader // Jun 4, 2008 at 11:52 am
JayBlissNectar hit the nail on the head! Anti-psychotic meds are definitely in order for poor Arjuna. The “froth” (from him frothing at the mouth) is slimily dripping down my monitor and making a big mess.
And Rati, maybe you shouldn’t have “outed” Eric as being single…..now the Hing site will probably be crashed by hoardes of women logging on all at the same time.
20 Lalita Madhava // Jun 4, 2008 at 12:52 pm
Since I do not live in a temple right now, I have begun randomly throwing myself against the walls of my house and against the walls of various public buildings to “practice” for the next time I visit a temple. I do not want the fact that I am a grandmother or that I live outside the temple to be an impediment to my being able to get the hell out of the way with the best of them!
Also, I am very grateful for the link to “Arjuna’s” new Hare Krishna Diary – has anyone else noticed that Hare Krishna Diaries are multiplying like somethng out of a horror movie? – in which he has most helpfully pointed out that I am a “former devotee.” Otherwise, silly me, I never would have known and would have continued to uselessly labor – chanting japa, reading Prabhupada’s books and working toward opening a center – under the illusion that I was still a devotee! I feel very liberated now that that has been cleared up!
21 Devak // Jun 4, 2008 at 7:44 pm
Kanhangad, Kerala, India
Dear Maha mataji Lalita Madhava:
I pronam before you. [It may not be proper though...but who cares]
Being a devotee of Krsna is like being a Marine. Once a Marine…always a Marine. Sempre fi.
All the best in your sincere endeavor to start a new Temple to honor Lord Krsna. Marble is the best way to make it nice always. Stucco painted like marble is not good for your karma. It’s just like costume jewelry – fake.
I don’t see your friend Arjuna on The Hing today…yet. Maybe his guru got ahold of his dhoti and scoulded that naughty boy.
Anyway, this Internet Cafe is about to run out of electricity and I have to hurry with my comment. The cafe walla is glaring at me to close my laptop.
Maybe Arjuna should go to Rishikesh and take a dip in that 40 degree F. water. That’ll clear his mind for sure. If not, it’ll suspend any notions of romance for a measure of time.
May all the blessings of Srila Prabhupada be upon you now that you are finally liberated and that any blemishes on your lovely face have cleared up.
Devak….always taking the high road of happiness
22 Praveen // Jun 4, 2008 at 10:31 pm
Hare Krishna Devak Prabhu,
Just wanted to say that maybe you should lay off the comments about Arjuna Prabhu’s guru maharaj.
Bhaktisvarup Damodar Maharaj attained maha-samadhi in 2006 so its still a little taboo.
-praveen
23 Devak // Jun 5, 2008 at 3:06 am
Hare Krishna Praveen:
I called the local maharaj at the nearby Temple and left a message with his servant. I did very politely and humbly ask if there was a certain amount of time that should pass before we can comment on His Divine Grace His Holiness Bhakisvarup Damodar Maharaj.
The servant did mention that the moon must pass over the goshala ten times before the maharaj answers any such questions.
Could that be the answer? I suppose it best for me to wait and see but I must leave soon .
Devak…..swinging the pendulum for answers.
24 Rati // Jun 5, 2008 at 10:50 am
Appreciative Reader- I hadn’t even thought of that! Good point. Anyway, we probably don’t have to worry too much. I think all that smashing into walls over the years has effected the brain function of most brahmacarinis. Otherwise, how is Eric still single???
25 Rati // Jun 5, 2008 at 10:55 am
Lalita Madhava, that’s hilarious! Good job for keeping up with the practice! hahahaha!
26 Appreciative Reader // Jun 5, 2008 at 11:21 am
Rati…
Well, either it’s as you say, that all the brahmacarinis have brain damage, OR he’s VERY young (too young for those of us who are not following in the footsteps of Demi Moore) OR he’s gay. But his being gay would still not stop the crashing of the Hing once our dear friends at GALVA got wind of it…
27 Devak // Jun 6, 2008 at 4:06 pm
Kanhangad, Kerala
Friday
Dear Devotees of the Hing:
Just got a message from the local Swamiji:
“Dead Swamis are not reading the various websites…..they are in the heavenly realms with Krsna and the gopis.
PS: Devak: As a former guru, do you really think it is wise to be spending your time taking surfing lessons at Kovalam Beach? Remember, Kerala is not Malibu. Get serious about your spiritual life for a change.”
Devak….OK, whatever.
28 Rati // Jun 6, 2008 at 6:47 pm
Definitely brain damage.
29 Devak // Jun 9, 2008 at 11:46 pm
I had to leave Kanhangad late last night. I traveled by auto rickshaw one thousand miles north. The next day I saw this article in the local newspaper and I copy it here for you dear ones.
+++++
In India, One Former Hare Krishna Guru Fights to be Lower on the Social Ladder
The Gujjar community in northern India is regarded as a ‘backward class’ — a designation that entitles it to education and job quotas. Now it is agitating to be classified lower, to get more benefits.
June 8, 2008
SIKANDARA, INDIA — Sitting in the middle of a highway under a baking hot sun is not former Guru Devak Ananda Das’ idea of a good time. But it’s the best way, he says, for him and hundreds of fellow protesters to vent their anger over being classified by the government as a “backward” class near the bottom of India’s social ladder.
Devak states, “I want to be lower….these are my people”.
The demonstrators, members of an ethnic group known as Gujjars, have blocked traffic for two weeks here on the road leading to the famed Taj Mahal.. They vow to remain where they are until the government reclassifies them, putting them at the bottom of the official social hierarchy. Shri Devak says he is fallen and wants to be with these people to be even lower.
Devak’s presence would in essence drop the Gujjars to a level similar to that of India’s former “untouchables,” who were pariahs under the ancient caste system. But it also would entitle them to more favorable quotas in education and public-sector jobs that the government has set aside for the nation’s most oppressed and least modernized groups in an effort to redress historic wrongs. It’s all about money….as usual.
It is the world’s largest affirmative-action program, and the Gujjars say they deserve their fair share of it.
“Our Hare Krishna community is just as backward and tedious ” as the former untouchables, declared Bhakta Burja, 32. “We need the same kinds of benefits as they get.”
He and his fellow demonstrators have brought life to a standstill in a large swath of Rajasthan, a state in western India popular with tourists for its imposing desert forts and picturesque cultural life.
The protesters bivouacked in the middle of the highway here have cut off the link between the city of Jaipur, about 30 miles away, and Agra and the Taj Mahal, a key artery not just for tourists but for movement of goods. Gujjar women have sat down on train tracks and disrupted rail service.
The demonstrators also have destroyed public property, pulling down stoplights and ripping out highway guardrails to fling onto the pavement as roadblocks alongside uprooted trees, boulders and the charred frames of burned-out motorcycles. Economic losses stemming from two weeks of protest are estimated at more than $1 billion.
Rajasthan’s government has been widely condemned for its bloody crackdown, with the central government describing the situation as a “complete collapse of law and order.” The state’s top elected official, Chief Minister Vasundhara Raje, took out half-page ads in national newspapers last week admonishing people that it was “not the time for allegations and counter-allegations…back to your Temples.”
Along with harsh criticism over her handling of the protests, there has been criticism of the welfare program that is at the root of the Gujjars’ agitation.
However well-intentioned, government quotas have sharpened caste divisions rather than healed them, critics say, and encouraged “a race to the bottom” as groups such as the Gujjars clamor to be recognized as more disadvantaged than others in order to qualify for a larger pool of benefits and quotas, known here as reservations. Newly arrived Devak desires to be that line.
What began as a program specifically intended to remedy discrimination against untouchables — those shunned as ritually unclean in the Hindu caste system — and the isolation of indigenous tribes has morphed into a tool of political patronage for parties hoping to win votes by promising to extend benefits to one poor community or another.
“Unfortunately, somewhere down the line we took our eye off the ball and we began to equate reservations with anti-poverty policies. The two are quite distinct,” said Dipankar Gupta, an expert on caste at Jawaharlal Nehru University in New Delhi.
When the Gujjars began making their demand last year, they found themselves in conflict with another disadvantaged group, the Meenas, who saw the Gujjars as trying to muscle in on the benefits they enjoyed on Rajasthan’s bottom tier. They finally begged Devak to come to Rajasthan.
More than 20 people died in rioting. The confrontation ended when the state government agreed to review the Gujjars’ status as one of India’s so-called “other backward classes,” the second-lowest classification. A blue-ribbon panel’s recent recommendation that the Gujjars be given a $900-million aid package, but not the “Scheduled Tribe” status they sought, set off the new round of protests.
“Meenas have been enjoying this status for some time now. We’re in the same areas as they are, and we’re just as backward and stupid as them, and it didn’t make sense that they had this status and we didn’t,” said Nepal Singh Arya, 34.
A road-construction contractor who lives in Jaipur, he acknowledged that his button-front white shirt, jeans and sturdy leather shoes hardly painted the picture of backwardness.
Most Gujjars, though, are agricultural laborers and cattle herders, some too poor to own land.
“In Rajasthan, a lot of this community [are] in a dire situation,” said Sachin Ramjan, a Gujjar member of Parliament, who noted that Gujjars in other parts of India, such as the Himalayan state of Jammu and Kashmir, have been granted the tribal status.
No one is predicting how the standoff will be resolved. The leader of the Gujjar movement says he is willing to open talks with the state government, but his followers remain defiant.
“The cops are constantly putting pressure on us, and the state government isn’t inclined to talk to us,” protester Burja said. “We’re fully prepared to face bullets and anything else that might happen. We’re so happy that pitiful ex-guru Devak from America is finally here and stands firmly with us. He’s our hero.”
30 Devak // Jun 11, 2008 at 7:08 pm
Dearest Devotees:
Things aren’t working out for my renewal of karma here in Sikandara.
It appears that these low caste people want to be even lower just to get more welfare money. They do that in the United States and it just doesn’t seem like correct action. The cheaters and the cheated. Where is Krsna is all of this maya?
I have been advised to go and live at the temple of the rats. The swamiji here told me that this may be the final and best way for me to rise above my fallen state. I am wondering if I may have to eat the same food at they feed the rats. From the pictures I have seen, the rats seems well cared for….maybe too well cared for.
I’ll let you know what happens as soon as I can get there.
Devak….. waiting for the next train.
PS: Former American gurus are not qualified for welfare in Rajasthan State. Now they tell me!
31 Nandini // Jun 12, 2008 at 12:13 pm
Mother Abhava,
What a wonderful example you set! You truly are a subduer of the senses (and sensibilities) and thus rightly named Abhava, She Who, For Krsna’s Sake, Has No Sense Of Relationship Whatsoever. Good job!!!
32 Swami Iconoclast // Jun 17, 2008 at 4:15 am
I disapprove of this website! It mocks some of the teachings of Srila Prabhupada, who is the guru of the world. Prabhupada was perfect. Every word he uttered/written was perfect. He never made any mistakes! One is forbidden to observe the activities of a pure Vaisnava from a material point of view. In other words, we are not allowed to use our own limited and imperfect logic and reasoning to assess such pure souls as Prabhupada and his followers.
33 Rati // Jun 17, 2008 at 10:08 am
Hey Swami! I liked your signature on the petition to rescind resolution 311, especially your gurumaharaja.
34 Elfreda // Jun 22, 2008 at 5:17 pm
You sad people.
35 mallapraharanadas // Jul 7, 2008 at 7:10 am
Haribol AGTSP
hehehehehe i cant believe some devotees gets irated when they read this, its clearly says “Sattirical” so its only laugh about ourselves and improve, its a way to see ourselves in the mirror, smile and chage in a happy way. keep on goin !!!
36 Isn't it? // Jul 9, 2008 at 8:39 pm
She is most advanced Mahadevi. If she would come to my home to get the hell out of way while I go to fridge to grab cold one my life would be complete
37 OTSTAL Om Tat Sat Thanks A Lot // Jul 20, 2008 at 2:15 pm
I lived in the San Francisco Temple in mid-1970’s. Sankirtan Book Distribution was in full swing. Someone got the great idea to kick all the women out of the temple. It was felt that ridding the world of all women was the answer to all our problems. There was only 1 Brahmacarini pujari who refused to leave.
Every man who lived in that temple during that time, including all the sannyassis are married now.
38 syama // Aug 3, 2008 at 10:33 am
What a wonderful example this mataji is setting she should give my wife some pointers who definately needs to learn to get the hell out of my way
39 Appreciative Reader // Aug 3, 2008 at 6:14 pm
Dear Syama,
Unlike the women Hing readers who got all offended, thinking the “women are lustier than cows” article was serious, we are sure you are just joking about your wife getting the hell out of your way.
If you’re NOT joking, please let us know immediately, in which case a special ops team bearing super-starched (i.e., stiff as a board) kaupinas and other implements of torture will be immediately dispatched to teach you a few important lessons…
40 syama // Aug 4, 2008 at 4:40 am
I love my wife dearly she can’t help having a smaller brain but this matajis exemplry behaviour espescially leaving marks on the corridoor walls is so vedic that I feel my wife would benefit imensely from her association.
no need for the kaupins!!!
41 Appreciative Reader // Aug 4, 2008 at 2:58 pm
“Your wife can’t help having a smaller brain”?
The “women have smaller brains” concept was a mistaken idea (about as scientifically sound as the medieval theory that the earth was flat) that Prabhupada got from his teacher, W.S. Urquhart, at Scottish Churches College in 1918 and then elevated to practically the level of absolute truth within ISKCON and based his “teachings” on.
42 Kenny // Aug 4, 2008 at 3:05 pm
As for the “smaller brains” thing, Prabhupada didn’t seem to take it all that seriously. During an interview, he claimed that his female devotees had 64oz (man-size) brains. He certainly didn’t really believe that when becoming a devotee, a woman’s brain grows. Therefore…
43 Appreciative Reader // Aug 4, 2008 at 6:08 pm
Hey, Kenny, let’s see the quotes for that interview…..
Prabhupada took this bogus idea VERY seriously and, along with the corrupted text of the Manu-samhita, it created the basis for his whole sexist/misogynistic attitude, which is represented in practically countless quotes. After his infamous “interview with the woman reporter” in 1975, Prabhupada called her a “prostitute” the next morning because she hadn’t accepted his incorrect statements.
Let’s not whitewash the dark and shameful issue of Prabhupada’s blatant misogyny and the fact that it is obviously the source of all misogyny in ISKCON.
44 Kenny // Aug 4, 2008 at 6:38 pm
He took it so seriously that you had to use CAPS LOCK to express it? Odd. Cause I don’t think he took it so seriously. He was very liberal with women in so many circumstances, including giving them second initiation.
Prabhupada, in a SB purport said that non-vaisnavas have a small quantity of brain substance. He also often referred to all our brains (human brains) as “tiny.”
In the vast majority of quotes from Prabhupada about brains, he does not differentiate between man and woman. In the cases where he does, there were in conversations with devotee (morning walks, etc).
The quote that I referenced I heard from Malati, I believe.
Oh, and as for calling the woman a prostitute, I’ve read the whole conversation, Prabhupada was hardly being serious.
You statement that Prabhupada was the source of all misogyny in ISKCON is downright silly. Are you saying that not a single devotee had a single sexist thought before meeting Prabhupada? Very silly. Prabhupada made statements that could easily be abused. There have been many so called devotees who have taken advantage of this and the movement has suffered greatly for it.
But all this begs to ask, why are you reading The Hing? If Krishna consciousness is as horrible as you seem to believe, why have anything to do with it at all?
And why quote Jar Jar? Such a great offense!
45 Appreciative Reader // Aug 4, 2008 at 9:08 pm
Hey, Kenny. Peace.
“He took it so seriously that you had to use CAPS LOCK to express it? Odd. Cause I don’t think he took it so seriously. He was very liberal with women in so many circumstances, including giving them second initiation.”
No big deal with the “Caps Lock.” I just used caps for emphasis because I felt it was called for after your unsubstantiated negation of the facts.
“Prabhupada, in a SB purport said that non-vaisnavas have a small quantity of brain substance. He also often referred to all our brains (human brains) as “tiny.”
In the vast majority of quotes from Prabhupada about brains, he does not differentiate between man and woman. In the cases where he does, there were in conversations with devotee (morning walks, etc).”
I’m sorry, Kenny, but your “vast majority” calculation is not accurate. Fully 80% or more of Prabhupada’s statements about women (including his mistaken ideas about their brain size) were negative in character. (Please see Ekkehard Lorenz’s research on the subject in his essays, which are included as chapters in the book, The Hare Krishna Movement: The Post-Charismatic Fate of a Religious Transplant, by Edwin Bryant and Maria Ekstrand
(Columbia University Press, 2004).
“The quote that I referenced I heard from Malati, I believe.”
OK, but there are millions of “Prabhupada said” quotes. Let’s see it in writing.
“Oh, and as for calling the woman a prostitute, I’ve read the whole conversation, Prabhupada was hardly being serious.”
He was being completely serious, as anyone who reads the transcript can easily ascertain. Just like he was serious when he called Indira Gandhi a prostitute. The “Hare Krishna Diary” kid, following in his GHQ guru’s footsteps, must have trawled the VedaBase for Prabhupada’s every use of the word “prostitute,” because he included them all in his blog, to create a rather stunning presentation. From that sickening compilation we can see exactly how Prabhupada used the word…..and how he meant it. Sorry, Kenny, but the harsh reality is that he was totally serious.
“You statement that Prabhupada was the source of all misogyny in ISKCON is downright silly. Are you saying that not a single devotee had a single sexist thought before meeting Prabhupada? Very silly.”
Sure, devotees had sexist thoughts before meeting Prabhupada. But since Prabhupada set himself up as the “as good as God” “Founder-Acarya,” and taught his disciples that “his books would be the lawbooks for mankind for the next ten thousand years,” and since his every word was reverentially recorded as absolute truth, he really had the responsbility of “austerity of speech” (Bg. 17.15). Thus, his countless statements that “women enjoy being raped,” that “women should be beaten like dogs and dhol drums,” that “any unmarried woman is a prostitute,” and that “women are less intelligent and should never be given independence,” really ARE the basis for the institutionalized misogyny in his organization.
“Prabhupada made statements that could easily be abused.”
As Dhyana-kunda pointed out in the old Com discussions, what is really troubling is how easily Prabhupada’s statements lend themselves to abuse.
“There have been many so called devotees who have taken advantage of this and the movement has suffered greatly for it.”
These devotees are not “taking advantage” of anything. They are simply repeating the words of their spiritual master, as they have been trained, by him, to do.
“But all this begs to ask, why are you reading The Hing? If Krishna consciousness is as horrible as you seem to believe, why have anything to do with it at all?”
Kenny, you are completely misunderstanding my point. I do not think that Krishna consciounsess is horrible. Krishna consciousness is wonderful. Lord Krishna is wonderful. The Holy Names are wonderful. Kirtana is wonderful. The Vaishnava philosophy is wonderful.
What is “horrible” are the bogus deviations and distortions, such as misogyny, racism and child abuse, which are found pervasively in Prabhupada’s teachings and in ISKCON.
“And why quote Jar Jar? Such a great offense!”
Um, that was in another post.
46 Kenny // Aug 4, 2008 at 9:25 pm
My “vast majority” comment was about *brains* not women. Cute little juggle there, though.
Also the dohl drum was from Tulasi das (poet). Prabhupada quoted it and used it to tell Nara-Narayana to not beat his wife, saying, “These are not ordinary women. These are devotees.”
I still maintain that they were taking advantage and abusing Prabhupada’s words by focusing on specific things he said, much like the GHQ folks did and much like you are doing.
We may not ever agree, and I’m ok with that. Hare Krishna.
47 Appreciative Reader // Aug 4, 2008 at 9:34 pm
Prabhupada: “So sasan ke adhikari means they should be punished. (laughs) Punished means, just like dhol, when the, I mean to say, sound is not very hard, dag-dag, if you beat it on the border, then it comes to be nice tune. Similarly, pasu, animals, if you request “My dear dog, please do not go there.” Hut! (laughter) “No, my dear dog. Hut!” This is the way. Similarly, woman. If you become lenient, then she will be troublesome. So in India still, in villages, whenever there is some quarrel between husband wife, the husband beats and she is tamed.” (laughs) (Room Conversation—April 12, 1969, New York)
48 Appreciative Reader // Aug 4, 2008 at 9:43 pm
Kenny, you say, “I still maintain that they were taking advantage and abusing Prabhupada’s words by focusing on specific things he said, much like the GHQ folks did and much like you are doing.”
Well, how do YOU explain the “specific things he said”? (Unapologetic use of “Caps Lock.”)
And the only reason I and others are “focusing” on those things is because those statements have provided the “authority” for four decades of egregious abuse of women and children in ISKCON.
With all due respect, Kenny, the “specific things Prabhupada said” really do need to be acknowledged once and for all. No more excuses. No more denial. No more rationalizations. No more burying our heads in the sand.
_/\o_
49 syama // Aug 5, 2008 at 6:15 am
as a smaller brained prostitute lustier than a cow my wife ‘bless her’, does her best and we should always see our not as good other halves in that light.
Like children who need a good slap they do their best but are victims of fate!
I have allowed my wife to worship my kaupins thrice daily and she is slowly advancing along with looking after 13 kids and cooking and cleaning all day untill our kutir is spic and span she is now offering such nice arati to my starched kaupins.
I think she is happy
50 Nandini // Aug 5, 2008 at 9:05 am
Bravo Appreciative Reader, well said!
Misogyny and some other forms of abuse in Iskcon DID come from specific things that Srila Prabhuapada said, unfortunately. The good news is that there is no need to reject Prabhupada and Krishna Consciousness because of his wrong statements. We just have to treat them for what they were: a sad mistake.
Acknowledging the facts regarding our history is the only possible solution to making progress presently and into the future. Indeed, if we choose to stick our heads in the sand and deny that Prabhupada made mistaken statements, statements that are now clearly presenting an impasse to the spreading of Krishna Consciousness in the world, we risk to wipe off Krishna Consciousness from the face of this planet – do not doubt it for a moment. There are symptoms of decline of faith even among us already.
For starters, the topic of guru tattva must be better understood in Iskcon, Gaudiya Math, and in the Gaudiya Tradition at large. Srila Prabhupada is being singled out as the source of misogyny and other errors, but he is simply carrying on with a long tradition. He was a victim of a culture which was for ages, utterly afraid of women and human sexuality in general.
51 Pam Ho // Aug 5, 2008 at 3:42 pm
You must not give in to peer pressure Kenny prabhu. Clearly Prabhupada was pure in all he did and it is everyone else who is impure, that goes without saying. It has been established by divine authority that Prabhupada (who is like to God) is divine authority! Any problems that result from his teachings are not his fault, they are the fault of everyone and anyone but him. That is a fact. Do not even get me started about websites like the following which dare to question the fact of Prabhupada being faultless..
http://harekrishnawomen.wordpress.com/2008/06/09/prabhupada/
52 Nandini // Aug 5, 2008 at 4:02 pm
Pam Ho
Apart from it agreeing with the general consensus that some of Prabhuapada’s statements were off, everything else in that website is just down right retarded. The owner cannot even explain what her/his philosophy is about. Apparent her/his alternative for going beyond Iskcon is watching tacky TV shows and Youtube clips. Great stuff yeah right.
53 Pam Ho // Aug 5, 2008 at 8:01 pm
Nandini
You are correct, the nonsense youtube is maya for karmis, the only thing from youtube that is not maya are clips of kirtan, or lectures from great devotees such as yourself! Those things are desired by real devotees!
54 Nandini // Aug 5, 2008 at 8:24 pm
Well Pam Ho, there is intelligent maya and there is stupid maya.
There is more to being smart than bashing Iskcon, you know?
I know lots of ” karmis” who would not waste a second on the clips put up on that site. They would say, “what dim wit nonsense selected this crap?”
55 Pam Ho // Aug 5, 2008 at 8:29 pm
Nandini
I now know that I must accept you as my guru on this seeing as how you are such a tasteful delicate personality. Can you point out the despicable “clips” you speak of so that we can all be forewarned about them?
56 Nandini // Aug 5, 2008 at 9:05 pm
No Pam Ho, the guru position clearly should go to the one who puts up and entire website to direct people to watch pop culture on youtube. These clips (or whatever you call them) really are a step above the narrow, unsubstantial, skin deep, dismissible, obtuse, constricting, and oh so confining instructions one may find in classic spiritual literature.
57 Boy-R-D dasa (not the chef) // Aug 5, 2008 at 11:37 pm
It was something that always bothered me the quote from Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Prabhupada – “there are 3 things you should beat:
a drum, your mind, your wife”.
I pushed my wife once, when we got first got married. She left me for the weekend, so I never tried it again. Usually when there is a fight, I take a long walk, sometimes yell and scream, and then come back refreshed and ready for more.
I have been in an ISKCON arranged marriage now for 32 years.
Beating of women is from an older time. Social conventions change over time. What was popular and hip during the 60’s, as an example, probably seems very tame and old fashioned today.
We don’t understand the Manu-Samhita, and we probably aren’t qualified to follow it. We think we are so smart because we don’t follow it or believe in it. But the joke may be on us, because there are reactions that come to us for not following the lawbooks of mankind. It may also be a sign that we are lower class men and women (Yavanas), if we refuse to follow Manu’s laws.
58 Pam Ho // Aug 6, 2008 at 12:20 am
Nandini
I thought you wanted us to avoid those clips because they are “nonsense crap”. Now you tell us that they are better then”classic spiritual literature”. I looked at some of them just now and they didn’t seem to be anything more then comedic sketches and music. I know I should see anything not directly preaching the glories of the Lord as Maya Devi trying to keep me in the material world (she is so mean, what is up with that?). I am confused now. First you tell us those clips are “nonsense crap” (I agree, there is nothing funny about the material world, laughter and karmi music is for karmis), now you tell us they are superior to scripture and other spiritual literature? I am confused and do not know my duty. I am your disciple now, I fall at your lotus feet with straw in my mouth awaiting your divine glance, please instruct this lost soul.
59 Nandini // Aug 6, 2008 at 7:48 am
Pam Ho,
Pop culture is crap I don’t care how hard you try to be sarcastic. Get real babe.
60 Pam Ho // Aug 6, 2008 at 6:32 pm
Nandini
On that blog these verses are quoted at http://harekrishnawomen.wordpress.com/2008/07/30/karma-chameleon/
Sri mad Bhagavatam 11.28.6-7
The Supersoul alone is the ultimate controller and creator of this world, and thus He alone is also the created. Similarly, the Soul of all existence Himself both maintains and is maintained, withdraws and is withdrawn. No other entity can be properly ascertained as separate from Him, the Supreme Soul, who nonetheless is distinct from everything and everyone else. The appearance of the threefold material nature, which is perceived within Him, has no actual basis. Rather, you should understand that this material nature, composed of the three modes, is simply the product of His illusory potency.
Srimad Bhagavatam 11.13.24
Within this world, whatever is perceived by the mind, speech, eyes or other senses is Me alone and nothing besides Me. All of you please understand this by a straightforward analysis of the facts.
Obviously “pop culture” is not meant to be included in what should be seen as a manifestation of Krishna since you have kindly pointed it out as all being “crap nonsense”, and Krishna is not “crap nonsense”.
Still I enjoy a lot of “pop culture”, especially comedy shows such as Curb Your Enthusiasm; The Office”(both versions); Entourage; Extras (on HBO); Reno 911; That Mitchell and Webb Look (on BBC); and many others. I also enjoy a lot of “pop culture” music such as The Beatles; Bob Marley and the Wailers; and many others.
But as you say they are all “crap nonsense”. Therefore we should disregard Krishna’s words in the above quotes. After all, life is short, we can die at any moment, we should only spend every moment of our lives in service to the guru, helping him in his mission of trying to makeover the world into a Vedic paradise. Everyone must be made to follow 4 regulative principles and reject any attempt to enjoy the senses (as I am sure you are a shining example of) if they are to escape punishment for the sinful enjoying spirit, and go back home, back to Godhead.
Even if we can understand and see Krishna’s control of all reality, and presence everywhere, as He suggests in the above, we have no time to waste on anything but trying to save the world from Maya’s plan to keep everyone suffering in ignorance of Krishna (what is her problem anyways?)
Yours in service
The most lowly and unfortunate
Pam Ho
61 Appreciative Reader // Aug 6, 2008 at 6:41 pm
I am wondering if any of the unsuccessful book distributors who failed because they did not look like John Stamos went on to get karmi (God, it really makes me flinch to use that awful word even in jest) jobs as referees? It’s looking like we’re gonna need one here…..
62 Nandini // Aug 6, 2008 at 7:09 pm
Look ,
“Seeing” Krishna everywhere without serving him is the twisted convenience of sense gratifiers. You want Krishna without guru and that is where your philosophy caves in. You don’t like Prabhupada, fine, get someone else then. But don’t expect much sympathy for your (excuse again but I gotta call a spade a spade) crap. I tell you what, get Mike Myers for guru. He will help you see that Krishna is, lets see, Michael Jackson? Is Michael Jackson a good Krishna for you? Good. But you gatta have a guru!!
AR,
No need referees, we are civilized people here. Thanks though.
63 Pam Ho // Aug 6, 2008 at 7:31 pm
You are totally correct Nandini. Only “twisted sense gratifiers” want to see Krishna everywhere without submitting as a slave to a guru. After all gurus need slaves and Krishna likes gurus. Put 1 and 1 together = Krishna wants us to be slaves to gurus.! Makes sense to me.
Anyone who thinks they can approach God in any other way then through a guru is a sinful twisted sense gratifier who will be punished for thinking so highly of themselves. God is only revealed through a guru. God cannot and will not respond to anyone through any other way because God hates sense gratifiers who think they are so advanced that they can perceive the presence of God without being a slave to a guru. Like I said, makes perfect sense! Thank you for your revelations. I now know I need to find a guru to serve before I can see Krishna anywhere.
And if by chance I do see Krishna’s control and presence in this world, say here…or elsewhere, I will pretend that I didn’t because I am not yet a slave to a guru and I don’t want to anger the wrathful Lord.
once again
begging for your mercy
the most incompetent
and
most sinful
Pam Ho
64 Appreciative Reader // Aug 6, 2008 at 8:55 pm
You’re welcome, Nandini. Just a feeble attempt at comic relief : /
65 Nandini // Aug 7, 2008 at 10:10 am
Pam Ho,
If you made yourself slave to your guru and are now bitter, or think slavery is what the guru-disciple dynamics are about, you miss the point by too many miles. Get your gurutattva correct there girlfriend. There simply ISN’T God to be had without his servants: Its always a crowd.
66 Caitanya dasa // Mar 24, 2009 at 1:05 am
This is nonsense. Bhakta Eric is a nonsense rascal. For god’s sake, he claims to have been a devotee for 15 years, and has not yet taken diksa? If that is not the sign of a complete rascal, I do not know what is.
Bhakta Eric’s rantings is just more of the compromises and deviations that are going on in ISKCON, and all of the grhamedhis support him in his nonsense writings.
das,
Caitanya dasa
Edit from rascal #1: I’m just allowing this comment to come through to let anyone reading have an idea of Caitanya prabhu’s mental state.
To Cd, I’m sorry you are so lonely that you feel you need to post here to get some sort of attention. Seriously, there are better ways to do it. Go find some friends and stop trying to advertise your blog on my site, you sad little man.
- Eric
67 nitai-gauranga dasa // Mar 27, 2009 at 4:20 am
although eric did not post my little tirade i made a few weeks ago, and offered no explanation, and he even went as far as to not accept my friend request on facebook, i have to say in his defense that Srila Prabhupada took diksa 12 years after he met his Gurumaharaja. and people still tend to hold him in high regard. so 15 years aint really all that long, now is it. perhaps, mr. caitanya dasa, you might want to revise that statement about him being a complete rascal. it just makes you look silly. and who knows, eric might be a nice guy after all…
much love.
ngd.
ps. can you post my rant and be my friend on facebook now?
Eric here – I just let your rant in and thank you for the Srila Prabhupada example.
In your first comment, you ended with (and I quote) “Fuck you.” After that you sent me a friend request on Facebook. Needless to say, I was a bit hesitant to accept, what with all the “fuck you”ing going around.
I hope you understand.
68 nitai-gauranga dasa // Mar 28, 2009 at 12:57 pm
hey eric,
sure i do. it was a funny thing. in one of my infinite digresses from school work, i thought to myself “who is this guy anyway” and i found your other website and thought that you seemed like a neat guy. then i thought how funny it would be if we became friends having that be our first interaction. true story…
anyway, i just sent you another request. dont be a baby. just accept it.
ngd
69 Mandakini // Apr 28, 2009 at 11:37 am
wow. nothing like being preached to by misogynistic, fanatical crazees
eric-keep on keeping on. your website is awesome. i love to laugh and really appreciate your humor.
caitanya das~ couldn’t get a rise out of criticising my blog so you came here?? nothing says dignity like questioning a blog post about my son’s 5th birthday celebrations not being Krishna conscious. Nothing like being put down by a complete stranger. and then you have the cajones to try to spam your blog at my blog!?! *can you see my eyes rolling into the back of my head??*
i’ll repeat what i said to you at my blog:
You leave no opportunity for comment/feedback or even any way to contact you on your blog, which leads me to believe that you are indeed simply an internet troll.
kthnxbai!
70 Deepali Det // Apr 29, 2009 at 7:40 am
The Article ‘Brahmacharini gets the hell out of the way’ is utter bull shit.
I was born and gew up in Iskcon and never felt the need or the expectation to act like Abava dd.
I think her behavior is over the top and childish. You do not have to throw yourself against a wall to get out of the way. And these idiot brahamachari’s should bloody get over the bodily platform.
We are all eternally female any way – Prakriti.
There is also more to chastity than they way one dresses. If she was so chaste then wny did Menaka das notice her curves?
And why is her name comming up in a Brahmachari’s Bhagavad Gita study group? Obviously the brahmachari’s are more disturbed than they are accepting.
Insted of being fanatic and worrying about these stupid little things. Try to find true K.C.
71 Rati // Apr 29, 2009 at 9:32 am
Deepali- hahahahhaha!!! Oh, my God, you’re too funny.
72 jaganat // Apr 29, 2009 at 9:56 am
The true value of this articles is seen in the comments. The articles are so much to the point and reflect reality though humor so vividly that invoke the naked nature of the reader. Eric, you can provoke like by magic human behaviour nature poorly disguised as devotee character.
73 gaurangi devi dasi // Apr 29, 2009 at 11:25 am
aww bless her heart
74 Deepali Det // Apr 29, 2009 at 7:23 pm
RATI – I really don’t know what you find so funny. This article is extremly sexist and quite disturbing if this kind of crap still goes on in Iskcon
75 Rati // Apr 29, 2009 at 9:03 pm
Deepali- I’m guessing that perhaps you’re not american? I think sometimes things can get “lost” in language.
This article, and in fact the whole site is pointing out the insanity of such things. Obviously, no one (okay, well maybe not “no one” but no one normal) would expect anyone to throw themselves against a wall. And the thing with the brahmacaris discussing her amongst themselves shows their silliness. And come on, as someone who’s spent any amount of time around Hare Krishna temples, you must have come in contact with people like that? I know I have.
BTW, I’d love to know your thought on the “Chowpatty Riots Over Who Is Most Fallen” I think you might find that one easier to understand.
Hope you’re having a great day.
76 astottara // Jan 25, 2010 at 6:11 pm
This is my favourite site ever, I have to say. I haven’t laughed this hard since watching the FoI sense grats anonymous play.
I just had a realization this morning, what would ISKCON be like without the fanatics who haven’t yet learnt to think for themselves and tell others what they can and can’t think? Dare say empty but sounds like a lot quieter, if we take just the comments on this site as our data pool.
At least there is hope for Arjuna dasa, noting the current rise in popularity, and trend, of taking shelter of psychiatric counseling. Sometimes I wish I was still that fanatical… Everything seemed so easy and thoughtless.